Disappointment with Keylab MK3

Lab KeyLab
#1

As an owner of A Keylab 88 MK2 I am profoundly disappointed with the MK3 version. It is difficult to believe that after 5 long years and multiple suggestions from users, this is the best this great company could reveal as its new flagship controller.

Sadly the display, which although is effective and utilitarian, is again quite modest in comparison to some others and not great for the visually impaired. They could have added smaller screens below or above the faders like Korg and Novation, and dial lights would have been nice. Moving on, the next is
 no poly aftertouch, which along with no MPE no MIDI 2.0 and no NKS integration, is so obviously where the market is going. On the plus side they have implemented release velocity. Nevertheless, if the previous omissions weren’t enough Arturia reduced the pads from 16 to 12, axed the track selection buttons, CV outputs, the extra expression pedal inputs and mains operation. Although a sequencer and ribbon control strip might be wishful thinking, generally, it seems they have taken away as many expressive and practical features as they’ve added.

I am desperately hoping they release a more pro version soon for sound designers, composers and experimentalists or give the above features to the MK3 88 and I will buy.

Does anyone agree? Should Arturia release a more pro expressive line worthy of the title “Master” or “Controller” keyboard?

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What are the new owners thoughts on KL3
#2

Hi @Laurence. Welcome to the community.

Thanks for your comments/ inputs.

You will not find any NKS integration in any none NI controller unless NI allow it and get their share. I can do without, perhaps unless we get a much better system that’s generel for all hardware and software developers.

I think there are pros and cons to 12 pads. Btw you have 4 banks of 12 pads i believe.
It’s true 16 pads is standard for much. But how many do use 16 pads at the same time?
12 pads is an octave, so it’s easier to keep in your head, when you use banks.
I’d rather have 12 very good functional pads than 16 not as good pads, if that’s the case. Here size can matter too.

I would like an option to choose channel- and standard Poly aftertouch. Some of Arturias software instruments originally had such poly aftertouch.
It’s good having release velocity. Arturia have software that can use that.
I think many would like a new controller with the Polybrute Keybed and x/y/z pad. I think that would be a more exspensive product line if so just like MPE.

I personally would like a X/Y control too. Arturia do have software that have joysticks. And it’s good to have anyway.

Same argument could go for a ribbon control.

I for example also would like multiple banks for other controls than pads.

I actually would like something like multipage mapping.

I would also like value screens for each control, but i only need it on the computer screen i think. Displays are aften not used, and often quite a bit of the price. But yes with MIDI 2.0 and a Parameter name and Value screen for each control would be nice and as close to hardware synth we can get. That said, then MIDI 2.0 is’nt even supported very much yet, but hopefully within not so long time. I think Microsoft Windows are working on the support.

I personally don’t need CV control, sequencer or chord functionality and such. Arturia have other controller lines. And some software already have build in sequencer and Chord functionality and such. There are other things that are more important for a keyboard controller.

I for example like Arturia have added more control over Velocity and Aftertouch curves in Keylab 3.

EDIT: perhaps also read this thread:

EDIT END

#3

I’ve listed my complaints multiple times elsewhere so I won’t keep repeating them just to bore people senseless. TLDR I already have an NI on order now, which I kicked to the right for FAR too long thinking the MkIII KL would answer my prayers. I can’t wait to try the NI’s poly aftertouch on some of the the CS80 V’s presets; it will massively improve my expressiveness as a synth player.

It’s like Arturia just completely missed the target and undertook no UR at all, nor looked at what competitors were offering in the same sector.

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#4

I recognise your needs may be met with this version and I realise this may well be the best compromise keyboard for others, however, for many upgraders the MK3 is more of a sideways step than a new iteration. Even the screen which is a step up from the MK2 is still at least 5 years behind NI’s S series and even then, the previous S series had two screens of a similar size. Do not get me wrong, the Keylab is still a very very capable keyboard which I’m sure will continue to be purchased. For me and quite a few others its just not the best in class but now simply one “you should also consider”. So, in the next few years it might be up to Novation, Nektar, Korg or M-Audio to create the controller everyone had hoped for (again, I hope Arturia prove me wrong with the MK3 88 – seriously). As for the version name, this is more of a MK2-A (for alternative).

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#5

It’s daunting to think it might be 5 years before I purchase another Keylab controller. In that time things will have moved on substantially with poly aftertouch, MPE and MIDI 2. I reluctantly have to ask myself just how far behind competitors will Arturia’s flagship controllers then be? That is scary. Currently, I will be keeping my MK2 88 but the S3 88 is seductively calling (and I am solemnly contemplating). Sadly, as Arturia seems to have capitulated to the Native instruments series, it looks as if I and many others will be eyeing up the S3 line for some intimate “Kontakt”.

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#6

Komplete Kontrol S-series have no pads, no faders and only 8 knobs, only a very small touch strip, no CV control, have no MPE but do have polyphonic aftertouch. I also don’t think Komplete Kontrol support MIDI 2.0.
Komplete Kontrol is quite exspensiv. (Much more than a Keylab 3.) How exspensive would it be with all that apparantly is missing taking the wishes for a Keylab into account?

I can actually do without Pads. I would like to trade pads for a switchable channel and poly aftertouch keyboard and some buttons in Keylab. I can use the keys for drums.
A touch strip should be longer to add a good feeling i would say.

I can’t see the Komplete Kontrol S ticks my needs, and even less ticks the boxes that the complains concerning the Keylab 3 is about.

I certainly do have my wishes for a Keylab as i wrote.

What is the direct competition controllers excactly - and on which parameters?

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#7

One thing is clear. If Arturia is really planning to release a “pro” version with the obvious things missing with Keylab MK3 they must do it before Black Friday. Nobody would buy another midi controller for quite some time if they already bought one recently.

Last week I did a livestream on my channel where we discussed the alternatives. There is no perfect solution for all. Korg Keystage is interesting because of Midi 2.0 and PA. But no faders and no Pads. Having small displays for every knob is kind of nice but not a competition for a big screen. Also no led light guide which comes in handy every time you want to operate key switches.

It seems it is better to buy single hardware controllers according to your needs. Native Instrument S3 series plus something with faders like Studiologic SL Mixface and something from Novation for clip launching or something from Akai if you rather prefer real drum pads. That’s around 300 to 400 Euros extra. NI’s controller is also a plus 200 Euros if you compare it to the Keylab MK3.
Of course, if Arturia wants to release a “pro” version these 500 to 600 Euros are not in play. But I could imagine that people would be ready to pay up to 999 for something with 61 Keys that checks all the boxes.

But then I look at the Novation 61SL MKIII and how old it is. And it seems, Novation might be working on this one midi keyboard controller everyone wants. Who knows?:man_shrugging:

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#8

just to throw in some perspective. I am new to the Arturia KeyLab experience. I came from a very old Novation LaunchKey MK1. The complaints that are given about lack of NKS or Midi 2.0 (that seems to be a standard waiting for an industry to wrap their head around and accept). Poly Aftertouch would have been nice and I will give this as a sort of valid point.

But I don’t know where you are located for your purchases, but here in Canada, the Artura 61 MK3 cost $750, where the NI S61 MK3 is $1100, so a significant jump up in cost. For that exrta expense, you do not get any pads to use. It seems that some here complained that the Mk3 went from 16 pads to 4 banks of 12, so the loss of 4 physical pads but with more alternate banks to use. The NI give your ZERO so you are now spending an additional $350 minimum for a maschine micro, that you will likely be disapointed with as it doesn’t have a screen so you’d want to get the maschine controller for $800.

The S61 does have a very nice screen. Where you get however let down is that the compatibility of this nice screen it rather limited to the NKS enabled products. I know Arturia has released NKS for their software music plugins. But if we are going to be complaining and moving to NI on the midi controllers we can assume that you are also going to be using an awful lot of other plugins from different third party vendors that NI doesn’t play alll that nice with.

I am not saying that Arturia didn’t drop the ball in delivering the best controller midi keyboard with the MK3, but don’t start comparing it to other vendors unless you bother to show where they fall flat and have worse offerings as well.

I did look at the NI when I decided on my purchase this month. I shot it down as it just didn’t meet my needs as well as Arturia KeyLab did partly from the cost perspective, but also in function. I said I will give up poly aftertouch to get a far more versatile user interface. But that was my choice at the end of the day.

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#9

Can your keyboard hit full velocity without hitting the keys super hard? Mine doesn’t unfortunately.

#10

I’m not sure any of us have done this tbh. I have however made it clear that I don’t personally give a toss about sliders, knobs and other physical controls because I have external control surfaces for that, and that my main disappointment is the keybed still not offering poly aftertouch. That was my #1 ‘want’ from a new controller, literally above all else, otherwise I may as well just keep hold of my antique Mk1.

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#11

Probably going to wait & see if Novation bring out a new SL Mk4 before making a decision.

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#12

Guys, lets keep things lite, cordial and respectful. Remember I am asking for your views on a new tool for your artistic musical expression and whether it is worthy to carry the name MK3. Assumptions about what I have factored in or out are exactly that. Views should not have to be assumptive or aggressive (this is not X/twitter) and I am not attacking personal choices.

I could explain who I am or what I know about the design and manufacturing process, however, there is no need for that. Suffice to say I’ve been around these industries for some time.

Arturia are a musical software and hardware manufacturer producing tools in an increasingly cash competitive marketplace. So, telling them that a particular product is groundbreaking, game changing or revolutionary when (in many areas) they are half steps, sidesteps or non-advancing won’t promote company ambition or innovation for the next iteration of products. That benefits no-one.

The backlash and disappointment about the MK3 has already led to rumours of a more “Pro” version release. Sadly, I doubt this is actually true but who knows. Please tell me what you think about the Keylab’s pluses and minuses. You should also bear in mind that a wide variety of company eyes occasionally view these comments 
.and this time, they might listen.

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#13

I want Arturia to succeed. Of course, it is a challenge to make it right for every user. It seems, they aimed for a certain price segment. They had to make hard decisions to get there. They succeeded in that way.
The question is: does this feel like a flagship midi controller still? I can give you the answer only for myself. And I was just thinking, this is just average. A lot of the other users sitting on the fence waiting for the new KeyLab expressed the same motion. It is just not what they were waiting for.
Though Arturia showed that they are an innovation powerhouse with AstroLab and Polybrute 12, I see only a slim chance for a pro version. As it seems, they are busy squishing the bugs in KL MK3.

No, this KeyLab is what you get. Either it is what you want or it is not. That is the decision to make.
As a user you have to sacrifice features you want to make the decision which midi controller you buy. NI has no faders and pads. Korg has no light guide, no faders, no pads, no big screen (but lots of small ones) and Arturia has no light guide, no midi 2.0, not really a big screen, no PA and a crippled Pad set.
I could go with NI if I use a stand to keep my current midi controller in the mix. But I am still waiting for Novation. SL MK4 might be the answer for all the people not too happy with the current offering. The problem here: we do not know if Novation has the means to deliver. They just had their big launch with the LaunchKey series. So are there the resources for a flagship controller left? We do not know. And you can only wait for so long until you arrange with the current situation and make your decision.

For Arturia I hope, that the KeyLab MK3 will be a big success with the target group they made it for. But I won’t buy it. It is too much yesterday tech for my money. :man_shrugging:

#14

Have you tried calibrating the velocity curves?

#15

Actually I find it all to easy to get to full velocity. I have a KeyLab 49 MkII, but I don’t think that’s what the problem is. I think its more to do with the keyboard action itself, but more specifically, decades of playing as a hardened musician!?!

Yeah, I think I have built up a little too much hand strength over the time that I find it all to easy to play too hard on semi weighted keyboards.

I just wish there was away to adjust the bias of how the keyboard interprets the electrical signals or something. The custom velocity curves do nothing to help redefine what constitutes the keyboard’s maximum velocity.

#16

I did but there are only three adjustable zones. Piano, mezzo and forte. I couldn’t find a good balance adjusting the 3 zone as I really liked the default linear curve.

#17

Do you have a mk3? I had read that the mk2 is somewhat sensitive so I thought I’d be happy with the mk3 but I’d need to hit it with a hammer to 127. I emailed support and they said that’s how they intended it to be.

#18

It’s a MkII. I’ve only had it for a year, so I dont plan un upgrading it any time soon.

#19

I sold my Native Instruments Kontrol S61 MK3 earlier this year and bought an Arturia KeyLab 61 MK3 recently. I like the KeyLab MK3 much more than the Kontrol S61 MK3 mainly because of the pads and faders that were lacking in Kontrol S61 MK3. I think the keybed on the Arturia feels great, similar to the best Fatar actions I’ve played. I never used polyAT on the NI, so I don’t care that the Arturia doesn’t have it. The NI has MIDI 2.0, but there is no current use for it from what I see, no software or hardware supports it yet. Not that this really should make a difference, but it does to me; the NI is a big imposing, heavy slab, while the Arturia looks and feels refined and streamlined. And as you mentioned, the price is much more expensive for the NI, $300 more, in fact.

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#20

Typically, Arturia release their 88 key hammer action keyboard a couple of months after their synth action ones (July 2019). Large companies usually establish and then keep to a pattern or behaviour. Due to this I have to sadly say it is highly unlikely a change will occur with the 88 key version. However, I will be commenting on this thread until the the MK3 88 key appears just to see if any changes actually occur (or they announce a higher line of expressive controllers). Although this is a last-ditch hope, at least we will know for certain the finality of the KL line series.