Anyone using the 16rig with an external patch bay?
Good or bad idea?
Is it a viable workaround for the 4 aux sends limitation on the software patch bay (control Center)?
Thanks
Hi @browndwarf
I don’t own a 16Rig myself, BUT i’ve been using interfaces with multiple I/O for decades now and have ALWAYS used a patch bay, the reasons for using them FAR OUTWEIGH any downsides as they are just so flexible…No crawling around under or behind things to try and re-patch, pretty much eliminates the risk of breaking jacks (i’ve seen this done on more than one occasion), MUCH easier to see what you’re doing (provided you’ve labelled it up properly). Less wear and tear on your interface’s I/O jack sockets… New patch bays are usually cheaper to replace than expensive repairs and there’s less downtime because of it…
I think your question would possibly be better phrased as ‘Reasons to NOT use a patch bay’. 
HTH!
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The only reason I can think to NOT use a patch bay would be if you’re using the 16 rig sitting on a desktop instead of mounting it in a rack.
My 16rig is mounted in a (small) rack so sticking a 1U patch bay just above made sense to me.
One way to look at it is, why potentially wear out the connectors on a piece of kit worth $1300 when you can use a $150 patch bay to take all the wear and tear?
Most of your equipment, the 16 rig, your synths, etc generally put their audio connectors in very inconvenient places. Think of a patch bay as way of making all these the audio inputs and outputs on various pieces of gear available in one convenient (front facing) place.
The flexibility can be useful - e.g. I want to send a particular instrument directly to my monitors without involving the 16rig - I can just patch them together. Or I have one of those mickey mouse Korg oscilloscopes (NTS-2) and I can use patch cables to “tap into” any audio source without interfering with the normal signal path.
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Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Yes, my 16rig is mounted in a rack along with a ferrofish 16 and it’s a pain having to swap connections as the physical space in my setup is very tight.
The ferrofish provides an extra 16 outs and I’m fine working within the Arturia command centre to configure those outs to my outboard equipment and pedals. But I find the 4 aux sends very limiting.
Trying to weigh the pros and cons of having this flexibility with Patchbay with the costs and potentially new noise issues.
Thank you so much!
Thank you for your suggestion!
Decisions decisions decisions 
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Yes, the AF16Rig with the AFCC software allows you to route any input (32 analog/ADAT inputs of the AF16Rig and 32 USB inputs from the computer) to any output like a patch-bay.
The 4 aux sends only apply to the AF16Rig’s internal Main mixer (plus there’s the Cue mixer that could be used as an additional stereo send).
But if you if you are setting your mix busses / aux sends in the computer, you have 32 USB channels from the computer that can be routed to any of the 26 outputs (10 analog and 16 ADAT).
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Thanks for your insightful reply Sean.
My workflow is to sequence and arrange on a hardware sequencer. Using ableton mainly as an audio recorder. I will record a master stereo along with the stems. To this day, I still can’t quite figure out how to use cue mixer in a useful way.
Thanks for the reminder that all the inputs can be routed to any output. I guess I’ve been tunneled into thinking only in the aux sends routing. Will spend some time to explore this.
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I use my 16rig with a Samson S patch plus. The patchbay is so versatile that once you understood how you can use it, it has so many pros and so many things you can do…
If you think you need it, go for it without doubts
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Thanks for the recommendation. Been reading good things about the Samson and it’s likely the one I’ll go for!
no problem 
there is also the Behringer Ultrapatch Pro that works pretty good too. The only problem for me, it is that the switches normal-half normal-thru, are placed on the top of the device, so not reachable if you place the unit in a rack
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@SMVProducer
The ART one i currently have has the switches on the rear of the unit, they’re still a little tricky once you have all the jacks populated, but they’re reachable with a pen or pencil when needed.
HTH!
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Snagged a used Samson S Plus in great shape for a very reasonable price! This thing is truly built like a tank!
Working out my routing spreadsheet and it seems I might actually need 2 of them 
May consider the Behringer Ultrapatch cos the price is really a no brainer
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I have a 16rig and still have my older 18i20 gen3 connected via ADAT. They plumb into two ARTpro P48 patchbay units. I have the patch bay configured so that there are 4 rows of 24 jacks when you sit them above each other. A good patch bay with front switches for normal, half normal and thru is a better unit than what I have which is done at the back with only normal and half normal on my P48 bays.
- Top Row is Audio out from 16rig, 18i20 and audio mixers (Tascam and Yamaha Master channels + aux out channels).
- Second row is Audio inputs to my synths like samplers and outboard gear like compressor/preamps.
*Third row are audio outs from synths and outboard gears
*Bottom row are inputs to the 16rig, 18i20 and Mixer.
All of them are rack mounted above my Gator elite desk on each side in 4u heights. It allows me to have my favourite stuff plumbed in and normalled to the 16rig/18i20. But at any time I can pull out something off the shelf be it an effect pedal, another synth, etc I can do that on the desk and patch into my audio setup easily.
The other day I routed audio out of a synth into a pedal and back into the 16rig without touching the audio interface at the back. As another responder kindly mentioned this allows you to save the jacks on the interface from wear and tear. I could route audio out of the 16 rig, into say my elecktron digitakt sampler then patched back into an analog heat, a guitar pedal board on the floor and then back into the 16rig.
It is so handy that I do not need to use the internal software routing at all, which by the way I find very confusing (the gui is not intuitive at all). Just note that audio level loss and noise may occur with a patchbay as you are adding to your signal path with physical connections. Everything connected also gives rise to ground loop noises etc but if you have so many audio inputs why not use them at one time eh?
You will find it is quite an expense though. A patch bay is very cheap overall but the audio cables can get costly and I would highly recommend an audio snake twice the length you need in case you change something in future going from the 16rig to the patchbay. I ran seperate cables when I was beginning out and it was a spaghetti nightmare. Everything is cabled tied under my desk and hardly any wires other than patch cables are visible until I break out more gear.
I keep a drawing on my desk of the patchbay so I know what is what without having to label everything on the front panel and since I change things around a lot, I start to memorise the jacks anyway.
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Thanks for chiming in. My I/O is more or less like yours. 32ins and 26outs.
Took about a month to tear down and set up my 2 patchbays (an Art and a Behringer). They are sandwiched between my 16Rig and Pulse16. Yes, the benefits are immense. I could now patch into an old Lexicon MPX500 which had been collecting dust, along with my pedals. I know what you mean about the spaghetti of cables. I ordered some snake cables to keep things more tidy but in the end, it still became a spaghetti mess. But they are all tucked behind my 2 12U table-top rack stand so I can pretend the mess is not there hahaha
The whole enterprise is not for the faint of heart. Between the revisions in excel spreadsheet diagrams to troubleshooting connections while working in a tight desk space is something I don’t wish to relive now that everything is working as it should.
There were a couple of hair-tearing moments, for example. One of my stereo devices was only outputting on the left channel, and after swapping cables and trying out other channels, it turned out that my AFCC had both channels set to Left 
Like you, I have also printed the connections on a piece of cut-out which helps navigate the maze.
All in all, I think the effort is worth it. There’s a lot more flexibility and ease in the connections and when there’re many units to connect, the benefit becomes exponential.
I still wish a future firmware update on the 16Rig can add a few more aux sends. I have a pair more or less permanently routed to an Overstayer for every project. That leaves just 2 mono sends into 2 effects units. Anything else will need to be patched as insert effects via the patchbay (which is already better than before). Hope Arturia devs can implement this in a (soon) future upgrade 
A bit off topic, but I also added an IK Multimedia Arc Studio 4 while re-setting up the studio. Highly recommended piece of kit!
Thats great, this will be helpful for future readers looking to use patchbays with the 16rig. Maybe talk about your setup and the pros/cons you are having. I believe regular forum posters can get the ability to post pictures.
I wonder how you are routing your midi though… that i have not solved. Best of luck!
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HI Kimmy, I’m using a Cirklon sequencer which has 5 MIDI outs. Along with a MIDI splitter box, I’ve got my MIDI connections covered.
I also had a Blokas Midihub which is a very handy and programmable MIDI box before the Cirklon.