Relative Knob Modes, What are they?

Step BeatStep Pro
#1

Hi, I’ve had my BSP for a while now, but have just found the relative knob modes and wondered what they are for and how would I use them. I found no info in either the hardware or software manuals, so am seeking help here.

The only thing I found on the internet was an old unanswered topic from 10 years ago on the legacy forum.

I’m using MuLab on Windows 11 and am trying to get the knobs to work in pickup mode for plugins and Mux presets. Does anyone know how this works? Are these relative modes dependant on the host having scripting abilities?

Thanks for your help.

#2

Hi @sl23 . Welcome to the community.

I presume you ask about normal controls controlling parameters.

FYI: You search too narrow, if you only search for BSP results. Your question is generel and not product specific. I have been replying to topics about relative modes.

Relative modes only work with endless encoders. It make increaments or decrements to a current value send to it from the software it shall control. So the control is allways in the right position so to speak.

Absolute modes have the value the position of the control have. So if the value of a parameter is different, then the parameter will jump. Different kinds of “Pick Up” or “Soft Take over” modes excist to handle this. It can be a mode where the parameter do not move before the control is in the right position. Or it can be different kinds of scale modes where the control position and the parameter position go towards eachother so you get a soft take over. The parameter will not jump directly to the controls position. Often you only see this modes on faders.

And yes both ends of the signal needs to support a feature to work.

Hope this helps. Otherwise you might find more info on the web. Perhaps even videos. Perhaps not using BSP.

#3

Thank you for your reply, that’s a great help.

#4

So is this a host issue? I’ve tried setting the relative mode to all three settings and none seem to work on any synth I try. According to the app ShowMidi, relative mode just switches between two different values. So either the host needs to recognise this or each individual plugin does, which is it? Hopefully it’s the Host. :slight_smile:

#5

No not just the host.

For example a parameter in a synth need to be set to a relative mode, if you wish it to be controlled by a encoder set to a relative mode.

#6

I would have created a new thread but could not figure out how to do so.

My issue is Akai MPC specific (I have sent this to Akai’s support), but anyway…

I’m quite used to the Beatstep Pro and find it easier to use for live sequencing than the MPC One pads. So I’m just using the MPC for a sound engine and FX processing, minimally for track recording. I have one row of the encoder knobs set to track volumes for 8 tracks which is way easier than navigating back to the mixer screen.

Someone else came across this a few years ago, however I think I have additional detail.

Link to mpc-forums.com

I have the BSP encoder knobs set to “Relative CC” mode 1. Then I set the MIDI learn to Relative CC and mapped to track volume. This works fine for audio and drum tracks but not plugins (same issue with 2 different ones).

The BSP is actually sending out pairs of messages for each click, e.g. 64/63 or 64/65 in mode 1, 0/1 or 0/127 in mode 2, and then 17/16 or 17/18 in mode 2 (varies per track).

What the MPC Plugin track volume does in response is to jump up to about +6 dB. and chatter in the direction of rotation, but settles back to that value once you stop, as though it were being set by 2 different things. There’s no automation recorded in the tracks. I also tried the 2’s complement mode of the MPC. Tried everything. Neither the BSP or MPC documentation offers adequate detail in terms of what is really being sent or what is expected in the case of the MPC. The fact that it only affects plugin tracks is odd as well.

One workaround, apparently, is to use Absolute mode, although I don’t like that since I try to get the blend set ahead of time and this forces me to redo it.

The mixer automation is on a different MIDI channel than the plugin itself. I’m using “undefined” CC numbers in the 20-30 range. Mute toggles work from the BSP’s Step buttons.

I may see if it works better to have MIDI learn assign CC to the plugin’s volume.

I’m on 3.6.0 but subsequent release notes don’t allude to the issue or any fix.

Anyone else figure this one out?

DL

#7

Hi @Digital_Larry ,

To me i can sound like the relative modes set for the sending and for the receiving unit does’nt match.

All relative modes is supposed ti do increment and decrement of a current value.

#8

For sure, I tried all the possibilities, and since it only doesn’t work on MPC Plugin tracks, sounds like an MPC bug to me. Just checking here in the event anyone solved it.