[Bug] : Matrix : LFO 3 in single mode --> Envelope Attack (any one) or MOD ENV Delay

Brute PolyBrute
#1

Hello,

This one truly looks like a bug when creating a modulation route in the Matrix.

Source : LFO 3 in Single Mode
Destination : Envelope Attack (any of the 3 ones) or MOD ENV Delay

Works only if a negative modulation amount is used. A positive amount has no effect.

Can someone confirm ?

#2

I have tested this only with the attack on the filter envelope. Seems to basically work with a negative modulation amount. Using a positive modulation amount, there is no effect if LFO3 is in single mode, as you described.

BUT: As far as I have tested, the “bug” with positive modulation only applies to an attack value of 0. As soon as the attack has a value higher than 0 (even like 1%), the modulation also works with positive modulation amount.

@Michael_G Is this the same for you?

Sounds a little bit like “anything multiplied by zero will always be zero” :wink:

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#3

…to my understanding is the percentage value (%) relatively to the current value of the Preset.

Preset value is 0% = only positive Matrix value is possible
Preset value is 100% = only negative values are possible

btw: this is the only solution for most parameters to work smoothly

#4

You’re right. And exactly because of this it seems like a bug that the positive value in the modulation matrix does not work for 0% but only for 1% and higher.

#5

EDIT: Do you mean setting the knob to 0% and altering the value in the Matrix?
I need to try this myself.
Below was my first thought…
I leave the tip below in the answer, maybe one or the other has not tried it…

hmmm, I am using the “zero value and no Matrix reaction” very often.
Impressive example:
preset part “A” a massive bass - “Edit A” and set the ribbon value “Global Pitch” (Matrix) to 0
preset part “B” a nice lead - “Edit B” and set ribbon value to 27 (see below why)
set ribbon to “Scan”
split keyboard
Now you can play the bass left and the lead right - moving along the ribbon from start position above the appropriate key 12 half notes to the right or left will pitch the note clean by an octave - Teremin style. Part “A” stays dry.
Why it is a value of 27 - I cannot tell…
Another usage is giving upper or lower part a LFO wobble…

#6

The problem seems to only occur if using the LFO3 in single mode as source and an envelope attack as target. @Michael_G has also listed the MOD env delay as another problematic target in the opening post. Other sources and targets do not have this problem.

#7

I will check this out this afternoon and will report back.

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#8

Try this:

  1. Initialize the patch
  2. Set LFO3 to single mode and change the waveform i.e. to a ramp-down sawtooth
  3. Set LFO3 rate to 50%
  4. Set the Amp Env Attack to 0%
  5. Create a modulation with LFO3 as source and Amp Env Attack as target and a modulation amount of +100%

If I play a note, the envelope attack is not modulated but seems to maintain the 0% value.

Now, if you set the Amp Env Attack to 1%, you can hear that the modulation is applied now.

Maybe I am missing something here, but in my understanding the modulation should also work for 0% as the LFO3 should modulate the attack to 100% and then decrease the value back to zero again.

#9

This occurs only with Envelope Attack and Delay parameters. Even when they are not set to zero they are not modulated as they should on my synth but the result is not very clear.

When I switch off LFO 3’s Single Mode (and turn Trigger on), ENV Attack modulation works as expected. Then when I switch Single mode back on the modulation behaviour tends to be erratic : sometimes the ENV Attack is modulated sometimes not.

Also when I set ENV Delay parameter higher than 0% MOD ENV Attack is modulated as expected when LFO 3 is in Single mode.

I should add that I made my tests with a very steep LFO 3 rise (Curve and Symetry parameters fully turned Left) to get more or less a square envelope.

All this makes me think this is not necessarily a “bug” but rather an inaccuracy caused by the analog circuitry (which is not surprising) : it looks like LFO 3’s very fast start and the ENV start are not tightly coordinated as they would be in a full digital process.

#10

I can confirm there is something wrong. I started with a INIT preset with all MOD ENV set to minimum, LFO3 target MOD ENV Attack. To make some sound I connected the MOD ENV with Pitch Global (not nice but good for testing)
0% on the MOD ENV Attack is having no effect.

  • Moving the slider from top to bottom to the earliest appearance of the 0% will have an audible difference to 1%

EDIT:
Maybe it is correct after all:
The value of 100% (LFO3 Matrix) of 0% of the MOD Attack = 0% (…the Matrix tries to change 0% MOD Attack)
Turning the value of the MOD Attack to 100% (maximum value to alter with the Matrix - or less if required) and the LFO3 value to -100% = also 0%, but now you can turn the Symmetry and Curve knobs of the LFO3 to control the MOD Attack slope

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