AudioFuse 16Rig MIDI mapping improvements

Fuse AudioFuse
#1

I was trying out the MIDI mapping feature in the AudioFuse 16Rig today. It’s a nice idea, but I found some limitations with it that could be improved to make it more useful. Hopefully, the mods can use their ability to flag feature requests for Arturia on this thread, but I’m also interested to hear if there are other 16Rig users who have used a MIDI controller with it with more success. Any tips would be appreciated.

Support for MIDI from the computer host

Unfortunately, the mixer MIDI mapping doesn’t seem to work at all if the MIDI is sent from the computer to the USB-C port on the 16Rig. It only supports MIDI from the DIN inputs or the USB MIDI port on the front.

This is particularly disappointing for me, as I was hoping to build a custom Max for Live device to better integrate the 16Rig mixer into my Ableton Live workflow. It doesn’t look like this is currently possible.

I also wanted to configure the Ableton Push controller’s user mode to control the 16Rig mixer. Unfortunately, MIDI controllers connected to the USB MIDI port on the 16Rig don’t appear as devices on the connected computer, and devices connected to the computer can’t control the 16Rig mixer with MIDI, even with the computer set up to route MIDI from the controller to the 16Rig. So I can’t do this, either, unless I connect an additional MIDI cable from the Push to the 16Rig.

Even using Arturia’s own MiniLab 3 is inconvenient in this way. I was able to control the mixer when it’s plugged into the 16Rig USB MIDI port, but configuring the MIDI mappings for the controls on the MiniLab 3 requires reconnecting it to the computer so that MIDI Control Center can see it.

If you connect the controller to a USB Hub port on the 16RIg, then the computer sees it but the 16Rig does not.

CC vs. Notes

AudioFuse Control Center lets you map each control to either a MIDI note number or a MIDI CC number. Some of these combinations don’t make much sense to me.

Most of the controls are level controls for each channel, its aux sends, and the master aux return and mix levels, which only really make sense as CCs. When you set them to use MIDI notes they use the velocity of the keypress to set the level. It’s hard for me to imagine why someone would want this configuration. Even worse, when you use the Factory Reset feature for the MIDI mappings, it sets all of the controls to use MIDI note numbers, which is not how it actually came preconfigured from the factory. Originally, the level controls were all set to CCs. I guess that’s a bug, but it’s an annoying one, because there’s no way to get back to the actual original configuration other than by manually reconfiguring each control.

On the other hand, the previous/next bank buttons don’t really make sense as CCs, only as key presses. It would make sense to use an encoder to scroll through the banks, but since the mapping can only be configured as seperate previous and next buttons, there’s no way to set one encoder CC to control both. If you do map an encoder to previous, for example, turning it in either direction will make the bank control move back. If you try to map the same encoder to next, it will remove the mapping from previous. You’d have to use different encoders for next and previous, which would be pretty strange.

Finally, there are the mute and solo toggle buttons. It makes sense to use a MIDI note to toggle these. It would also make sense to use a MIDI CC value to set their state absolutely, for example by saying that CC values 0-63 turn it off and 64-127 turn it on. That’s not how it actually works, though. Instead, any time it receives a CC message, it toggles the state. That means that there’s no way to send a message that will always force a channel to mute, regardless of whether it’s currently muted or not. There’s also no way for a controller to query whether a channel is currently muted to work around this, which brings me to…

Bidirectional Communication

Many mixer controllers support bidirectional DAW control protocols such as Mackie HUI/MCU that allow the controller to receive the state of the mixer as well as control it. This is essential for features such as motorised faders, but also useful for mute/solo lights on the control surface. Unfortunately, the 16Rig doesn’t seem to support anything like this, which limits the level of integration a controller can provide. It also means that you often have to check the mixer GUI in AFCC to see how things are currently set, at which point maybe it’s easier to just use the mouse.

Clearly, the AFCC GUI does use some kind of bidirectional communication with the hardware over the USB-C connection to show and update its state, but this doesn’t seem to be documented in a way that anyone else could use it.

Other missing features

Some minor other things that would be nice to have.

  • Controlling the cue mixer (seems like a big omission, since a cue mix might be most useful to a performer who is not sitting at the mixing desk)
  • Controlling input and output gain settings
  • Preset selection
  • Support for fader banks with more than 8 channels, such as PreSonus FaderPort 16

I hope Arturia can look at improving some of these things in the future.

5 Likes
Controlling Lab series over AF16Rig USB-Host
#2

I strongly second the above post. Especially the part about opening up a usb port to control the mixer via midi. At present this cannot be done and is a limitation. Great post!!!

3 Likes
#3

Yes to everything in the opening post. For me, my first wish would be to have bidirectional comms. I want to be able to use the 16Rig without a computer which means using a midi controller. Mostly this works well but without the 16Rig sending midi messages back to the controller, the current mute state of a channel, for example, cannot be known by the controller. Thus it cannot give a visual indication of whether a channel is muted or not which makes managing the mute state of the channels almost impossible from a controller.

1 Like
#4

Yea, I really want to purchase this but I don’t like that you can’t control it via Mackie HUI/MCU. I have a Keith McMillan K-Mix that works using the Mackie protocol/HUI. I do wonder though, if it’s even possible for the 16Rig to work this way at all?

#5

Agreed. Support HUI/MCU and I will purchase in a heart beat.

#6

I just came here after having bought the Audiofuse 16rig and failed to control the mixer through an SSL-UF8
Not only the UF8 in Midi mode will send midi signals perfectly captable by DAWs etc. but the Audiofuse 16rig doesnt get them; but also when trying the UF8 directly through the “Midi” usb port, it deactivates because it needs a connection to the SSL 360 software to work properly (cant be used standalone).
I hoped that the Audiofuse 16rig was going to get usb messages from whatever is connected to the pc but nope.

So if it’s possible, I agree it’s a big feature request for me too

1 Like
#7

So I’ve been exchanging with Arturia’s support about that specific point, we are not done exploring the issue but TL;DR: there is probably a bug somewhere, and you have to use a specific midi port. Details:

  1. It is actually working, but only if the computer host softwares are sending the midi to “Audiofuse 16rig Midi Output” virtual midi port. For example, you can use a DAW like Ableton Live, make a midi track, redirect the midi output to that midi port and suddenly Audiofuse Control can see the messages and you can use midi learn. Without a DAW: On MacOS you can route midi input to specific output through some system settings ui, while on Windows you will have to use a midi routing software like Midi-OX (there are others, that one is pretty old).

  2. When doing so, once you have done mapping your midi messages to conrols, it will still not work, and that looks like a bug (as in it is not the intended behavior). I’ve been investigating that issue in depth and reported my experimentation results to Arturia, they are checking if they see the same thing.

  3. When using the “midi” usb port, indeed everything works, but also your midi controller will still be available from the OS and therefore the DAW. This is interesting to know if you want to use 1 controller but control both the mix from the Audiofuse and some other stuffs in the DAW. Note that this only works with midi-class hardware, so for exemple SSL-UF8 (that I have) cannot work in that port (it has a midi mode but it’s handled byt he SLL 360 software, not directly by the hardware, so it cant conenct to it through that usb port).

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#8

I got to the same point using an elgato streamdeck. I am able to get the software to learn the code but nothing happens when pressing afterwards. Did you get any progress with arturia support?

#9

Yes got an update recently: the issue is now identified, apparently there is some work to do to make it actually work and the midi-learn working but not the rest is clear why for the devs but was not seen as an issue at first, it is now (that’s my understanding). So probably it will be fixed in the future but unfortunately not soon.
The simplest way to fix the issue for now is just to dedicate a midi device to the midi usb slot, it’s still visible to DAWs though if you map it in Audiofuse soft it’ll already be in use there.

1 Like
#10

Today I finally got a dedicated midi controller for controlling the mixer but I hit the issue of the toggle buttons preventing me from mute/solo channels. This makes it basically impossible to control using that specific midi controller T_T