Arturia : Have a look at Expressive’s Osmose CE

Lab KeyLab
#1

…and see how a keyboard can be implemented to work with a DAW.

The jog wheel can scroll both horizontally (timeline) and vertically (tracks), is that soooo difficult to do? (and this is just ONE example).

Expressive E have clearly spent some time thinking how to best combine hard and soft, you can see clearly the similarities when in keyboard mode (the equivalent of Arturia mode)… but that’s where the comparison stops. The DAW mode written by Expressive E is better by miles!

See for yourself (The Logic version)

Hopefully yours,
Dids

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#2

Yes, that Osmose CE is definitely on my radar. I’ve been wanting a controller that supports MPE and would work great with my Synclavier Regen.

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#3

I’ve got the Osmose and, apparently, Expressive is going to make the DAW implementation available in a future update… so I could use the Osmose to control Logic and the Keylab for recording piano. A bit overkill though.

#4

I used to think I understood Arturia’s business model with their midi controllers, in so far as I thought their main concern was integration with their software packages (V Collection and Analog Lab). I thought their #1 USP was the hardware and software formed a brilliantly-integrated hybrid with pre-mapped and mappable controls to give especially live performers the UX of having 20-odd synths fully commanded by one keyboard. Arturia’s publicity videos always demonstrated the controllers used this way in simulated concert performances. Sure, the controllers offered DAW integration, but I figured it was secondary, because the market was already saturated with DAW controllers.

In fact, so sure was I of my understanding about what Arturia was doing with their midi controllers that someone on the old Arturia forum accused me of being a paid shill on Arturia’s payroll. Which was hilarious, especially when I showed that thread to my bank statement. (Spoilers: I’m not a paid shill, and I never was.)

But then Arturia threw me curved balls by:

1- Launching the AstroLab which is fundamentally a midi controller with AnalogLab built in, so you could argue that tight-knitted integration with V Collection and AnalogLab is a bit less important on the KeyLabs, certainly for live performers who will probably buy an AstroLab instead;

2- Launching V3 of their premium KeyLab midi controllers that still don’t have poly aftertouch, which some of Arturia’s own VSTs (notably the CS80V) require in order to be fully utilized.

So colour me “I know jack sh*t”, because Arturia midi controllers are neither the masters of third-party DAW control nor the masters at exploiting the full realizable potential of the company’s own software instruments. :crazy_face:

(Edited for poor grammar.)

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#5

I must admit, that i always have wondered why Arturia did’nt have a controller serie that could utilize all the keyboard features, modulators including Joysticks and/ or X/Y pads and input switches used in their software instruments. Features used in the originals even. Often with dedicated generel Midi CC’s assigned.

We talk about:
Velocity
Aftertouch Mono and poly (MPE or alike perhaps. MIDI 2.0 should take over from MPE in the future.)
Release Velocity
Breath Control
Modwheel
Ribbon control
All Piano pedals
Expression Pedal
Volume Pedal
Portamento Switch
Legato Switch
Leslie On/ Off and Slow/ Fast Switches and perhaps even Leslie connected or not Switch
Joysticks and/ or X/Y pads
Perhaps extra Foot Switch input
Perhaps extra Modwheel input
Perhaps extra Expression pedal input
Perhaps more …

#6

Exactly @LBH

Where’s the top of the line premium product that has you begging your bank manager for forgiveness but is so bristling with contemporary and future-proof features that you think to yourself well this could be the last midi controller I ever buy, it has absolutely everything.

#7

I don’t think such controllers exist. I would like to know which if so, but have never got an answer about this so does’nt look like it.
Komplete Kontrol S-Series have Poly Aftertouch i believe. And a Multipage control system. But lack otherwise.
Korg Keystage also have normal Poly Aftertouch (And also some MPE i believe). But they warn about not pressing Keys too hard as that could damage that functionality and that’s not good. It have Midi 2.0.
No MPE controllers or other controllers meet the demands either afaik.
Arturias Keylabs MK3 have Release Velocity but are missing other things.

The hardware DX-7 had external modulator inputs for Breath Controller, Expression/ Modulation pedal, Volume pedal, Sustain Pedal and a Footswitch Portamento. That’s 5 external inputs in total. This certainly add lot’s of external control and should be absolute minimum external modulator inputs.

I would like at least 5 external continuos modulation inputs: Breath, Expression, Volume, continuos Sustain, Foot Pedal (AUX 1).
And at least 3 external switch controls: Sostenuto, Soft Pedal, A forth Piano pedal or a Foot Switch (AUX 2).
In generel Midi CC that would be the numbers: 2 (Breath), 4 (Foot pedal - AUX 1), 7 (Volume), 11 (Expression), 64 (Sustain), 65 (Portamento - AUX 2), 66 (Sostenuto), 67 (Soft Pedal).
I would like if all 8 external controller inputs could work both continuos, switch momentary, Switch on/off, Step Switch in selectable multiple number of steps and what else can be needed.
I think that would meet most if not all demands for a permanent external controller set up.

I would like all instrumets to be able to take advantage of all 8 external input controls as reserved controls that also can work when the instruments are used in Analog Lab.

The Keyboard should at least have highly personal adjudstable curve and force settings for Velocity, Release Velocity and Mono and Poly Aftertouch, - and a sideway key movement modulator would also be great.
Then at least 1 Bender and 1 Modwheel (2 Modwheels would be great), 1 Ribbon control, 1 Joystick, 1 X/Y pad.
(Further functionality as seen in PolyBrute or Osmose CE like the FullTouch pressure would perhaps be welcome as an option too. Also a PolyBrute Morphing & multi-axis control could make out for some of the required controls instead of a X/Y pad perhaps or as something extra.)

9 knobs, 9 faders (Also for Drawbar use), 9 or 2x9 buttons for Solo and Mute in a DAW and for synths with many switches and multible step settings.

And i would like:
A multipage controller system.
Midi 2.0.
It don’t need info on displays (It’s fine to have), but i would like informations of controller parameter values on a computer screen.

It don’t need Drum pads unless they are much much better than using the keyboard keys.
Also i don’t think it need onboard Arpeggio, Sequencer or Chord and Scale functionality.
Price can have something too say too. But quality player controllers would be nice to have.

It might not be my last controller. The models might be unless something even better that also meet the demands turn up.

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