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Author Topic: Sequencer: individual gate length per step  (Read 2039 times)

Processaurus

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Re: Sequencer: individual gate length per step
« Reply #15 on: February 05, 2020, 10:59:52 pm »
Idea, if you don’t want to squander the mod lane on gate time, you could use (squander) the velocity lane, and use the velocity source in the mod matrix to change envelope release time, or the time of the LFO (set as a one shot to change vca or filter).

DrJustice

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Re: Sequencer: individual gate length per step
« Reply #16 on: February 05, 2020, 11:58:44 pm »
Yes you can, but the velocity lane, or rather the Accent lane, only has two values. Those are unaccented and accented with velocities 64 and 127 when you use the Play button, or actual key-velocity and 127 when you play the sequencer with the keyboard. While that can be used to good effect, it will not give individual gate length per step.

guyaguy

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Re: Sequencer: individual gate length per step
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2020, 03:03:44 am »
While not an actual gate control, an alternative is to use the MOD track to control the rate of an LFO with Retrig = Sngl, using a down slope saw or a square, then assign that LFO @+99 to the VCA or one of the filter outputs for Duo Split bliss. You could also control envelope segment times, but if you can spare an LFO it can be used an audio gate envelope with different duration for each step.
Just curious...What advantage do you find in using the LFO over varying the EG's Sustain or Decay per step?

For doing short percussive type decay sounds, there wouldn’t be much difference modulating the decay/release on the EG and a sawtooth LFO set as a one shot. The real emulation of a simple gate time would be using the square lfo, as a one shot, that would be modulating the “on” time of the faux envelope that the lfo is making. However, there is no decay possible, so it would be a choppy envelope sound.

If you use the custom LFO shape, you could do a smooth release ramp, but it wouldn’t quite be the same as a sustain stage on an envelope- the length of the release would be tied to the length of the sustain, because the whole LFO is just a little sequence playing out, and you would scale the length of the faux envelope by modulating the lfo time control.

Right I’m not seeing an advantage of using a one shot LFO rather than modulating the EG Sustain in the Seq Mod lane.

Not trying to argue the point—just trying to see if there’s something I’m missing!

DrJustice

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Re: Sequencer: individual gate length per step
« Reply #18 on: February 06, 2020, 04:28:46 pm »
Yes, of course you can also modulate the amp env sustain (the env must have reached the sustain segment forthat to have an effect). One advantage of modulating the VCA is that you do then also get to have a 'release' portion, or a non abrupt cutoff,  if using a downwards ramp LFO. There are no rules, and the more we explore, the better  :)

Processaurus

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Re: Sequencer: individual gate length per step
« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2020, 11:21:11 pm »
While not an actual gate control, an alternative is to use the MOD track to control the rate of an LFO with Retrig = Sngl, using a down slope saw or a square, then assign that LFO @+99 to the VCA or one of the filter outputs for Duo Split bliss. You could also control envelope segment times, but if you can spare an LFO it can be used an audio gate envelope with different duration for each step.
Just curious...What advantage do you find in using the LFO over varying the EG's Sustain or Decay per step?

For doing short percussive type decay sounds, there wouldn’t be much difference modulating the decay/release on the EG and a sawtooth LFO set as a one shot. The real emulation of a simple gate time would be using the square lfo, as a one shot, that would be modulating the “on” time of the faux envelope that the lfo is making. However, there is no decay possible, so it would be a choppy envelope sound.

If you use the custom LFO shape, you could do a smooth release ramp, but it wouldn’t quite be the same as a sustain stage on an envelope- the length of the release would be tied to the length of the sustain, because the whole LFO is just a little sequence playing out, and you would scale the length of the faux envelope by modulating the lfo time control.

Right I’m not seeing an advantage of using a one shot LFO rather than modulating the EG Sustain in the Seq Mod lane.

Not trying to argue the point—just trying to see if there’s something I’m missing!

Only advantage I could see is using the square lfo one shot as a simple on/off envelope with fast attack, full sustain, fast release envelope, like an organ, that you can vary the gate time that the envelope is on (simulating different lengths of time the note is held down), with the step sequencer.

The other methods would be good for changing the fade out length of each note (which could be great), but aren’t the same feel as holding a note for longer or shorter amounts of time in a sequence.

Yes you can, but the velocity lane, or rather the Accent lane, only has two values. Those are unaccented and accented with velocities 64 and 127 when you use the Play button, or actual key-velocity and 127 when you play the sequencer with the keyboard. While that can be used to good effect, it will not give individual gate length per step.

Yes, quite right, but I think even 2 gate lengths could be more interesting sounding than one. Of course, varying velocity helps the expressiveness of the sequence, so, if going for a more organic feel, there is a good chance you’d want to use velocity. An imperfect solution...

VAU

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Re: Sequencer: individual gate length per step
« Reply #20 on: February 07, 2020, 12:19:37 am »
In following up with the ticket, Edouard responded with:

"This is something I wanted to add to the 2.0 update, but this is maybe something too heavy. (memory wise).  I will keep it in mind for a future update if possible, if a value per step is not possible, I will try to add the capacity to modulate the gate length knob."




Other members stated in another thread, it would be very easy to expand the synth's memory. Why is this not offered then?
why is there no hardware  upgrade, which also would allow exciting firmware improvements?

guyaguy

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Re: Sequencer: individual gate length per step
« Reply #21 on: February 07, 2020, 12:39:09 am »

Only advantage I could see is using the square lfo one shot as a simple on/off envelope with fast attack, full sustain, fast release envelope, like an organ, that you can vary the gate time that the envelope is on (simulating different lengths of time the note is held down), with the step sequencer.

The other methods would be good for changing the fade out length of each note (which could be great), but aren’t the same feel as holding a note for longer or shorter amounts of time in a sequence.
Yes, of course you can also modulate the amp env sustain (the env must have reached the sustain segment forthat to have an effect). One advantage of modulating the VCA is that you do then also get to have a 'release' portion, or a non abrupt cutoff,  if using a downwards ramp LFO. There are no rules, and the more we explore, the better  :)
Ah I get it. I think we were just thinking of different initial EG settings. I had in mind one with a Decay stage, no Sustain, a bit of Release if desired. Then the Seq Mod would define the amount of Sustain added per step. It works essentially as a Gate length modulation in all of the patches I've used it in, but you're right that it does require reaching the Sustain stage. I'll play around more with the LFO method and see what I come up with!

 

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