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Author Topic: Where's the Sound Map function?  (Read 2274 times)

artao

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Where's the Sound Map function?
« on: May 21, 2016, 01:50:06 am »
After watching a video of a guy going through the new instruments, I noticed that the Sound Map did not appear to be there. So I went ahead and downloaded the manuals for several of the updated synths from V Collection 4.
Indeed, the Sound Map appears to be removed.
Why the HELL would you remove that? It was one of the most unique, and extremely useful, aspects of your synths. Removing that was a real dick move there Arturia. It may well be a deal breaker for me. I use that ALL the freakin time in my V Collection 4 instruments. It's hugely useful for making new presets, or starting points for new presets.
Seriously guys. WTF >:( >:( >:(
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vaikl

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2016, 10:33:07 am »
Why don't you READ the other AL2 posts (and the web FAQ) before you post already answered questions????

The V5 instruments are all new (engine, GUI) and are necessary to load and edit instrumenst in AL2. Without the V5 instruments you only get basic sound engines per instrument which can't be edited.

artao

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2016, 01:11:15 am »
Thank you.
What does your response have to do with the removal of the Sound Map functionality?
I'll answer that one for you: NOTHING
I'm posting these questions here because there is no over-riding forum for ALL the V Collection synths, and as such this seemed the most logical place to put such questions.
Thanks for playing.
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vaikl

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2016, 01:32:11 am »
The most logical way to technical support is to "read-before-post" and to open a support ticket. Arturia's support staff is normally answering in less than a day and they are very helpful. And i don't have the nerves and time to write the same answer into three different threads with almost the same content.


artao

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2016, 05:01:26 am »
There were NO other posts in here when I posted this and my other threads. My four threads were the first ones in here ... but please! feel free to direct me to some threads that address this issue. Or perhaps a FAQ that discusses the removal of the Sound Map. ... You can't, because it doesn't exist. I DID go thru the new forums and threads before posting about this horrible decision.
So, again, thanks for playing.   8)
This is not a "support ticket" issue. This is about the removal of one of the coolest features of their synths, which has been in them for forever. And now they suddenly remove them?
This is a topic that needs to be open to public discussion, not some private support ticket. I know for a fact I'm not the only one upset about this removal.
Is there a better place to put this? Free Speech forum is the only other one I could think of, but to me this seemed the more appropriate place, with higher visibility of this topic.
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gg_bris

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2016, 08:41:21 am »
yeah, real shame this feature is missing from the latest collection - any plans to reinstate it?

Seb

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2016, 04:51:54 pm »
Hello,

The Sound Map was removed in the V Collection 5 instruments. We did some tests on the use of the Sound Map and it showed that it was very rarely used. I can briefly explain why:

A big part of the code of our instruments was rewritten for VC5. This is how all instruments now share the same browser design, resizable UIs, toolbars, ... Because of this redesign, if we wanted to keep the Sound Map, we would have had to rewrite its interface entirely.

Also, you might have noticed that some parameters could not be modified by the Sound Map because they were not VST parameters: Any switches / non-continuous knobs like octave switch on the Mini V for instance. With the new instruments, these are now VST parameters. That means that the Sound Map algorithm would have to be rewritten as well to behave the same, not only its graphic interface.

We felt that there were much better ways to use our software developers' time.

I am sorry for those that will miss this feature. We are thinking of ways to make it reappear in the future but in a different shape and hopefully with more musical results.

Seb

artao

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2016, 05:29:48 am »
That is exceedingly disappointing. I use that feature all the time. It's one of the most unique features of your synths.  :'(
You say, "Because of this redesign, if we wanted to keep the Sound Map, we would have had to rewrite its interface entirely. "
Well ... you already had to rewrite the interfaces for all the instruments, so I don't see how doing that with the Sound Map is any more of a hassle.

I urge you to seriously re-consider this decision, and once you fix up some of the bugs I'm reading about, get on with the business of putting the Sound Map back. :)
Thanks.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2016, 11:33:42 am by artao »
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jackn2mpu

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2016, 08:23:23 pm »
Hello,

The Sound Map was removed in the V Collection 5 instruments. We did some tests on the use of the Sound Map and it showed that it was very rarely used. I can briefly explain why:

A big part of the code of our instruments was rewritten for VC5. This is how all instruments now share the same browser design, resizable UIs, toolbars, ... Because of this redesign, if we wanted to keep the Sound Map, we would have had to rewrite its interface entirely.

Also, you might have noticed that some parameters could not be modified by the Sound Map because they were not VST parameters: Any switches / non-continuous knobs like octave switch on the Mini V for instance. With the new instruments, these are now VST parameters. That means that the Sound Map algorithm would have to be rewritten as well to behave the same, not only its graphic interface.

We felt that there were much better ways to use our software developers' time.

I am sorry for those that will miss this feature. We are thinking of ways to make it reappear in the future but in a different shape and hopefully with more musical results.

Seb
How can your tests show that the Sound Map was rarely used? Do you have a backdoor snoop into everyone's systems? I think it was removed because Arturia doesn't have the technical skill to rewrite the code to make it work. Or if that's not the case Arturia should have spent the time and money to make it work.

As to this talk of vst parameters the whole world doesn't use vst format plugins. How about au format and aax format (for ProTools users)?

Sorry but that but about you're thinking of ways to make it reappear in the future holds about as much weight as the excuse/answer I got from Arturia people about the missing sampling/resynthesis function in the Synclavier 2.
de N2MPU Jack FN20
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masi

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2016, 08:47:41 pm »
I am sorry for those that will miss this feature. We are thinking of ways to make it reappear in the future but in a different shape and hopefully with more musical results.

To be honest I never really grasped the concept of the soundmap so I'm not sure if this has been possible with it: to morph from one preset to another programmatically from the DAW. Say, start with preset A at bar 1 and morph to preset B betwwen bars 14 and 16. That's what I would call a musical result.

artao

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2016, 10:05:39 pm »
To be honest I never really grasped the concept of the soundmap so I'm not sure if this has been possible with it: to morph from one preset to another programmatically from the DAW. Say, start with preset A at bar 1 and morph to preset B betwwen bars 14 and 16. That's what I would call a musical result.
No, that's not the purpose of it. The purpose is to create new sounds by combining up to 4 other presets.
In just the base sound map screen, you can click anywhere and drag, and it'll grab the 4 nearest presets and combine them "in some way" depending what direction and how far you drag. Instant new sound, without any knob tweaking.
The other way to use it is to select a preset and "save" it into one of the 4 slots at the top of the Sound Map screen. Once you have more than 1 of the slots filled, you go into the "Preset Morpher" view, where you can click and drag to adjust how the presets are "mixed" .. in real-time. Which is to say, if you play your keyboard AND click-drag in that screen, the sound will change in real-time.
Also, using this method, you can morph between 4 presets that are widely separated in the Sound Map screen. Just doing it in the Sound Map screen itself only grabs the nearest 4 presets, and it doesn't change the sound in real-time, only after you release the mouse.

I suppose you COULD set your DAW to record, and then just go about tweaking sounds in the Preset Morpher. .. hmm ... I might actually have to try that ;)

@jackn2mpu -- while I too wonder how they managed to determine how many people actually used this function, I doubt that their decision to not implement has anything to do with technical ability. More likely it had to do with time constraints. :)
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MR79

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2016, 11:12:31 pm »
Hi,

I need help please... I post in the forum but no answer...

I cannot create playlists in ALL the synths... Is it a bug?

Thank you for help!

artao

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #12 on: May 26, 2016, 12:28:02 am »
Hi,

I need help please... I post in the forum but no answer...

I cannot create playlists in ALL the synths... Is it a bug?

Thank you for help!
rather off-topic .. but i'll answer
I've only got the demos of Modular, Arp 2600, and Synclavier installed right now ... but I can create playlists in all three.
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890zx

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2016, 03:08:18 am »
Mr Seb:

Looking to your reply is evident that you have not the minimum idea about the purpose and the usage of the MIDI Bank Select (CC# 0 & 32) and Program Changes messages in a MIDI sequence.

This is a STANDARIZED procedure and no benefit can be achieved from returning to the pre-MIDI era, where each manufacturer had a private and uncompatible comunication protocol.

 

Koshdukai

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Re: Where's the Sound Map function?
« Reply #14 on: May 26, 2016, 08:52:34 pm »
About the Sound Map here's a video interview with Glen Darcey on flux's SynthSummitShow Episode 10
I know artao already seen it so I'm posting it so others can know about it too :)

https://youtu.be/v0BbH2N9eTw?t=1h6m51s
(Edit: new link to a re-edited video)

I also liked it and thought as one of the many unique cool features that would've liked spread to all VC instruments, no matter how "but it wasn't doing what we intended to!" that was but I do understand why it had to go... hopefully only temporarily, until a better solution is found.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2016, 11:20:17 pm by Koshdukai »

 

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