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Software Instruments => Pigments => Pigments - Technical Issues => Topic started by: fenderchris on February 08, 2019, 08:00:10 am

Title: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 08, 2019, 08:00:10 am
Just updated from Windows-7 to Windows-10 and now Pigments stand-alone will not run.

Any suggestions?

Note: The Pigments plugin and all of the V6 Collection stand-alones still work.
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: LBH on February 08, 2019, 05:09:08 pm
Have you un- and re-installed Pigments?
There should be no issues in windows 10.
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 08, 2019, 05:30:21 pm
How do I do that?

Do I need to somehow de-activate it in the ABC, or should I uninstall the app in Windows and then download it again from the ABC?

Or what? :)
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: LBH on February 08, 2019, 05:43:52 pm
You don't have to deactivate.

Beside that, then yesy uninstall Pigments. Then i suggest a restart of your computer. Then install thru ASC, or download Pigments from you account or the Arturia download site and install it.
Keep in mind, that it's allways a good idea to make a backup of your own presets, - just in case.

You can use this FAQ guide for the uninstall: https://www.arturia.com/faq/installation/uninstall-remove-a-software
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 09, 2019, 09:02:45 am
The online Arturia instructions mention clicking on the Uninstall button in the ASC when trying to uninstall a software plugin, but I can not find an Uninstall button anywhere.   Where is it?
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 09, 2019, 10:03:05 am
OK, I've uninstalled Pigments through Windows-10 and then clicked on 'Install' in the Pigments section in the ASC. Pigments is now re-installed and opens correctly in Windows-10.

However, there are some new bugs:

Bug 1:

1. Select Audio Settings from the main dropdown menu.

2. In the 'Device' section click on Windows Audio and choose ASIO  (I want to select my RME FireFace UFX as the audio device) - after a few seconds the program crashes with a 'Pigments.exe has stopped working' message.

However, , if I do not click in the first box (where it initially reads 'Windows Audio') and instead click in the box below it, all of the Fireface i/o's are already listed there and the desired one can be selected without the program crashing.

All of the V6 Collection stand-alones allow the correct audio device to be selected in the first box and only then will the relevant i/o be listed in the lower box.

Bug 2:

On initially opening the Audio Settings menu, the Sample Rate box shows 44100Hz and the Buffer size box shows 441 samples !  - if I then click in the Buffer size box and select a different buffer size (let's say 256 for example) 256 will be set and '441' will disappear from the list - never to be seen again.  This must be a bug - Whoever sets a buffer size of 441?  -  I've never ever come across a device that could even offer a buffer size of 441.

See image below.

Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: LBH on February 09, 2019, 01:58:30 pm
The online Arturia instructions mention clicking on the Uninstall button in the ASC when trying to uninstall a software plugin, but I can not find an Uninstall button anywhere.   Where is it?
The uninstall button in ASC appear at the lower right corner of ASC, when you select an instrument.
The link i provided also mention a method to use the uninstaller in the instrument folder.

On initially opening the Audio Settings menu, the Sample Rate box shows 44100Hz and the Buffer size box shows 441 samples !  - if I then click in the Buffer size box and select a different buffer size (let's say 256 for example) 256 will be set and '441' will disappear from the list - never to be seen again.  This must be a bug - Whoever sets a buffer size of 441?  -  I've never ever come across a device that could even offer a buffer size of 441.
The 441 samples is a Windows Audio thing. It's the samples that give a 10 ms buffer.

In the 'Device' section click on Windows Audio and choose ASIO  (I want to select my RME FireFace UFX as the audio device) - after a few seconds the program crashes with a 'Pigments.exe has stopped working' message.

However, , if I do not click in the first box (where it initially reads 'Windows Audio') and instead click in the box below it, all of the Fireface i/o's are already listed there and the desired one can be selected without the program crashing.

All of the V6 Collection stand-alones allow the correct audio device to be selected in the first box and only then will the relevant i/o be listed in the lower box.
I think it's strange, if you can't use your RME Driver. Especially if it work with your VC applications. I have no issues using my external soundcard with it's own ASIO driver.
You also don't have issues using your RME with your DAW, and can run Pigments plug-in in there i understand.

Have you tried to restart your computer?
Are your RME driver updated - so it's a driver for windows 10? I can't tell if it matters.
Updating a Windows 7 PC to Windows 10 can in generel require some driver updates, and perhaps other updates.
Do you have more than one ASIO driver installed, and are you sure, you use the correct one?

EDIT: Also are your RME firmware updated for Windows 10? EDIT END
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 09, 2019, 05:16:07 pm
Hi LBH,

LBH Quote ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Have you tried to restart your computer?
Are your RME driver updated - so it's a driver for windows 10? I can't tell if it matters.
Updating a Windows 7 PC to Windows 10 can in generel require some driver updates, and perhaps other updates.
Do you have more than one ASIO driver installed, and are you sure, you use the correct one?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have restarted the PC.
   
I will check the RME drivers but I believe they are up-to-date.  The interface is functioning correctly.

I only have one ASIO driver - The RME.

Attached is a picture that shows the Audio Settings section from the DX7 stand-alone. All of the V6 Collection  apps have the same layout and they are all working correctly. You can see that this layout is not the same as the Pigments layout (see my previous post). If they are all working with the RME audio Interface why is there something different about the Pigments Audio Settings screen? - and it crashes if I try to select the RME in the Device box.





Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: Jpro600k on February 09, 2019, 05:49:34 pm
I have not problem.
I can choose two drivers in the V6 collection and Pigments.
ASIO and Windows Audio
No problem with either driver.
The  system volume of windows audio has influence on the Windows Audio volume, but with the ASIO driver, it is not affected by the system volume.

I have attached audio settings.(This is Pigments)

Please execute with administrator privileges during installation.
Right-click on the installer and run as administrator.

Access to the folder may be unstable.
In that case,On the Security tab of the Arturia folder, change the setting.

On the compatibility tab of the executable file, click Change all user's settings,
 check the Run this program as administrator checkbox and press the OK button to apply.

Applications that crash may be solved with this.
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 09, 2019, 06:14:12 pm
@jPro600k:

On your right-hand image, if you were to click on 'Windows Audio'  and select 'ASIO' I believe the program will crash.

The V6 apps do not look the same as your two images. They have 3 boxes relating to Device selection and Outputs.  In the latest version of Pigments there are only 2, and they do not function correctly.

---------------


I have now updated to the latest RME drivers and the firmware was already up-to-date.
I've rebooted the PC.

The problem is still there.

Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 09, 2019, 06:31:52 pm
@LBH:

LBH QUOTE

The uninstall button in ASC appear at the lower right corner of ASC, when you select an instrument.
The link i provided also mention a method to use the uninstaller in the instrument folder.

------------------------

I can not see that! - If I click on Pigments  in the ASC the screen changes to show the version history. The bottom left-hand corner shoes Status and the bottom right-hand corner shows my email address and the ASC version number. That's it.

------------------------


@jPro600k:

jPro quote: -----------------------------------
Please execute with administrator privileges during installation.
Right-click on the installer and run as administrator.

Access to the folder may be unstable.
In that case,On the Security tab of the Arturia folder, change the setting.

On the compatibility tab of the executable file, click Change all user's settings,
 check the Run this program as administrator checkbox and press the OK button to apply.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What do you mean by this? - Are you talking about installing the program manually, without using the ASC?

If so, I can find no way to download Pigments without the ASC.



Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: Jpro600k on February 09, 2019, 06:40:10 pm
@jPro600k:
On your right-hand image, if you were to click on 'Windows Audio'  and select 'ASIO' I believe the program will crash.
---------------

Switching to ASIO will switch to Low latency Asio Driver and will not crash.
I have attached audio settings. CMI V
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: Jpro600k on February 09, 2019, 06:48:29 pm

What do you mean by this? - Are you talking about installing the program manually, without using the ASC?

If so, I can find no way to download Pigments without the ASC.

This is a way to make the application's executable file work with administrator privileges so that it is not restricted by user level.
Access restrictions on folders may interfere with application operation. I wrote a method for them.
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 09, 2019, 07:14:18 pm

What do you mean by this? - Are you talking about installing the program manually, without using the ASC?

If so, I can find no way to download Pigments without the ASC.

This is a way to make the application's executable file work with administrator privileges so that it is not restricted by user level.
Access restrictions on folders may interfere with application operation. I wrote a method for them.

Ok, I've downloaded the app from the Arturia download site and installed it in Admin mode as you suggest, but the problem is still there. It crashes if I click on Windows Audio and try to select ASIO.



Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: LBH on February 09, 2019, 07:20:55 pm
Hi fenderchris,

FYI - I use windows 10 too. And my Pigments do not crash when i switch between Windows Audio and ASIO.

The difference between your images is that in Pigments you have Windows Audio selected, and in DX7 ASIO is selected. If you select ASIO in Pigments, then it's the same as in DX7.

I think i once have read about RME should be run using a administrator windows account. I assume you are on such an account. Otherwise it's worth trying, even if other things work allready.

About the uninstall button in ASC please look at the attached image. Look where my red arrow point.

Unfortunately i can not suggest more that i have beside contacting Arturia support directly thru your account, if you can't get it to work. But i can't tell if this is about Pigments at all.
Pigments is newer than the VC6 applications. I don't know if anything is different about this, as i don't know about Arturias coding.
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 09, 2019, 07:49:40 pm
Hi fenderchris,

FYI - I use windows 10 too. And my Pigments do not crash when i switch between Windows Audio and ASIO.

The difference between your images is that in Pigments you have Windows Audio selected, and in DX7 ASIO is selected. If you select ASIO in Pigments, then it's the same as in DX7.


That is the problem! - ASIO can NOT be selected because the program crashes if I try to select it.

Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: LBH on February 09, 2019, 08:38:10 pm
Yes i know that's the problem. Just wanted to say that was the difference in your images, as you was asking in your posts. The layouts is the same. You can also change DX7 to windows Audio, and then it's the same as in your Pigments image. So nothing in the layout suggest there is anything wrong or different.
Attached is a picture that shows the Audio Settings section from the DX7 stand-alone. All of the V6 Collection  apps have the same layout and they are all working correctly. You can see that this layout is not the same as the Pigments layout (see my previous post). If they are all working with the RME audio Interface why is there something different about the Pigments Audio Settings screen? - and it crashes if I try to select the RME in the Device box.

The question is, why you have this crash issue when selecting ASIO? It's clearly not a common issue.

EDIT: I can also suggest you contact RME support. I don't know if it's possible the driver can't work for one application if it can for others, or if it can be blocked, or something else.

You can also try to run your RME driver in windows 7 compatibility mode. And perhaps Pigments the same. Just to see, if it make a difference. EDIT END
Title: The latest version is the following version.
Post by: Jpro600k on February 10, 2019, 05:17:40 am
The latest version is the following version.
Pigments   08-Jan-2019   98.1 Mb   1.1.1.503
http://downloads.arturia.net/products/pigments/soft/Pigments_1_1_1_503.exe
Title: There is no difference between the two.
Post by: Jpro600k on February 10, 2019, 05:39:59 am
I have attached CMI_V_and_Pigments_audio_settings.
There is no difference between the two.
Title: Re: There is no difference between the two.
Post by: fenderchris on February 10, 2019, 12:51:01 pm
I have attached CMI_V_and_Pigments_audio_settings.
There is no difference between the two.

Well there is here. See attached pic.

All apps were installed with the ASC.
Only Pigments crashes when trying to select ASIO.

In the picture, CS80 is on the left and Pigments on the right.

Audio Settings in all of the V6 Collection synths look the same as the CS80 pic here.
Only the Pigments one is different because it crashes when I try to select ASIO.

What is different about Pigments?
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: LBH on February 10, 2019, 01:36:30 pm
@Fenderchris

It is annoying to have an issue that's hard to explain and figure out.

I have explained why there are differences in your images above. It's because one is set on Windows audio and the other not. The dropdown menus you have in one but not in the other only appear, when ASIO is selected. If both are set to the same setting, then the layout is the same. Nothing in your images show that anything is wrong.

Your issue is, that you for some reason can't select ASIO for your Pigments without it crash. But as i wrote, then this is clearly not a common issue.
There is this thread about similar issue: https://forum.arturia.com/index.php?topic=93767.0
You can try to delete this folder and try again: "C:\ProgramData\Arturia\Pigments\tmp (This should have been done allready, if your uninstall was full. But does'nt harm to try.)

I can only suggest, what i allready have suggested in my posts - including contacting Arturia and RME support directly, if nothing else helps.
We don't know about Arturias coding.

I presume you have only Pigments open to use your RME soundcard, when you try to select the ASIO driver.
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 10, 2019, 04:19:24 pm
Some progress:

If I run it in Administrator mode and Windows-7 Compatibility, it does allow me to select ASIO and then RME Fireface UFX. I can then select the audio outs as normal. After confirming to Windows that the program has worked, it will load again, but very slowly. It takes about four times as long as the V6 synths (this may be normal as it has a lot to load).

I don't know why it should be necessary to do this with Pigments as all the V6 synths run without compatibility mode, but maybe Arturia will discover why at some point.



Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: LBH on February 10, 2019, 05:07:22 pm
Was all Arturias applications including Pigments standalone installed and working, when you upgraded to Windows 10 from Windows 7?

Was it a clean install of Windows 10 and all of Arturias applications afterwards?
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 10, 2019, 05:19:14 pm
All the V6 applications and Pigments were installed and working before updating from W7 to W10.

It was an upgrade from W7 to W10, not a clean install. After the upgrade, all of the V6 synths continued to work perfectly but Pigments did not work.
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: LBH on February 10, 2019, 06:15:56 pm
So nothing was done different.

Can this issue have to do with buffer settings?

The only thing i can see that's different is that Pigments standalone is installed in 64 bit ProgramFiles and not in 32 bit ProgramFiles folder. That might indicate the Pigments standalone also is a 64 bit application or have some different coding than VC6 applications.
I don't know, if this matter when using some soundcard drivers in Windows 10. Windows 10 have different audio coding than previous Windows versions. Windows Audio can work at lower latencies in Windows 10, and i believe others things have been changed. That might have an impact on audio drivers and applications in some circumstances.
However i assume your DAW run 64 bit, so....

I suggest you contact both Arturia and RME support.

Also i can't rule out, if something went wrong in your Windows 10 upgrade. But i would try Arturia and RME support first.
Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on February 23, 2019, 11:51:11 am
I think my problem is essentially the same as this one:

https://forum.arturia.com/index.php?topic=93767.0

Hopefully Arturia will fix it soon.

Title: Re: Windows-10 issue
Post by: fenderchris on March 12, 2019, 07:36:41 pm
This Win-10 loading issue appears to be solved with update 1.1.2.539. 

Thank you Arturia, but now what has happened to the POLY option that was on the bottom bar when Pigments was first released? I seems to have vanished.