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Hardware Instruments => Origin => General Discussion on Origin => Topic started by: u.n.i.t.e.d on September 25, 2013, 09:17:01 pm

Title: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: u.n.i.t.e.d on September 25, 2013, 09:17:01 pm
it´s now a long time ago since we get a real update (not just bugfixes) and i think it´s time to get a new one, to see that arturia still supporting the origin and not just all other soft/harware-synths.

my wishlist:
1.) Prophet 5 Osc & Filter Module
2.) Oberheim SEM Osc Module
3.) possibility to save origin-parameters wich are editet with an external midicontroller
4.) possibility to use all 1000 Sounds as User-sounds and not just 600

and if that is possible:
1.) Mg Modular Filterbank Module
2.) Steiner Parker Filter Module
3.) RSF Kobol Osc & Filter Module
4.) new effects
5.) the missing templates
6.) Elka Synthex Osc & Filter

hope that someone of arturia recognize that there are still many users out there, wich waits for an update
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: tertior on September 26, 2013, 11:20:44 am

You forget in the last update 1.4 a new multi FX,  new sem filter, voice modulator and thonewheel percussion.
Now it's me who's speaking and it's my vision of buisness; the next update (1.5) will be the last of Origin and it's better to wait for a good update.
But as good as you are kind and patient there will be a 1.4.5  ;)
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: synthguy99 on September 27, 2013, 03:01:02 am
I have to harp one more time on the CS-80 template.  While I'm not all that big on wanting templates, this time, it's really needed.  The synth engine begins to run out of steam when you try to build a full blown CS-80, and it usually won't play more than seven notes.  A template could be optimized a bit - hopefully, so that eight or more luscious notes will come pouring out.

The TAE analong modeling algorithm could stand a tweak too.  Most of the time, adding it just cuts polyphony, and can even sound a little worse.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: kadolodai on September 27, 2013, 10:11:13 am
a FM oscillator for me ;)
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: hermitnerd on September 27, 2013, 05:37:06 pm

VCS3 osc and filter, pretty please.   ;D  ;D
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: JacksonP on September 27, 2013, 10:04:40 pm
Hi,

Don't get my wrong, I have nothing against new modules or template(s).

BUT:  In my opinion, above all, Arturia should fix the Origin connection ASAP. Keeping your Origin organized is pain with it and it definetily should not be like that. For example, let's say you have a backup of a multi with 4 different programs and one of them (let's call it X) is your one favorite (many other multis use it). Now if you wanna import this multi to your Origin, what happens? First choise: you have to get a new empty place for this X, even if it is actually there already. Other choise: you overwrite same program (in Origin) with same preset. But in this case every existing multis will loose this X. Both cases lead to mess inside Origin and little by little everything get very messy. Same is with step seq patterns. It's true pain to keep it in order.

I am lucky to have two Origins, one at my home and other mostly on gigs.  I'd like to keep them close as possible to each other (= having similar preset library). This is very difficult with Origin Connection.

All this should not be that painful. In 200€ Microkorg editor/librarian is much much well organized and better made. And I am not even talking about any update inside Origin. It's about this only app which we got with our instrument...

(And yes, I've said this thousand times. But I feel I need to say this everytime when others want this and that new module etc.)
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: kadolodai on September 30, 2013, 11:03:28 am
Quote
Arturia should fix the Origin connection ASAP

+1
(edit name of presets, dependencies betwen presets/multi/patterns, name for patterns, demo mode for ear the sound when you edit with connection,...)

otherwise, I'm pleading for a FM osc because I don't find any modular FM synth (hardware) like the FM8 of native... It's could open huge possibilities with a little module...
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: Superwaldi on September 30, 2013, 10:11:56 pm
+1 Origin connection for improved and FASTER preset management

+ new modules

Moreover I want to see VST-Integration and an Mac Editor.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: tertior on October 02, 2013, 07:46:03 pm

 one Twisted Waveform Generator
  one Complex Waveform Generator

and one Triple Morphing Filter
If 'its not possible, I'm ok for a VCS3 osc and filter like Hermitnerd. :P
and in last a CS-80 template. ;)

Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: OlDirtyPastor on October 03, 2013, 04:56:57 am
This might seem like a no big deal complaint but for the longest time I've been waiting for an update that gives you more precise control over your bpm within the sequencer. What I've been told this is is called fine tuned bpm, in other words being able to dial up so etching like 132.4 instead of whole numbers like 132, 136 etc. you can clearly see that on the Origin it displays as though it's possible (bpm shows the decimal mark). It just boggles my mind that we haven't had a simple update that allows for this.

I'm begging you guys at Arturia, please make this a reality. Oh and a ARP 2600 template would be great too (when I bought mine I was very much looking forward to this and ultimately was disappointed).
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: JacksonP on October 03, 2013, 06:37:51 pm
We can all express our own wishes here, but I think the most important question can only be answered by Arturia: Is there still some development goin on or planned for Origin? There was a time when Phillippe was practically only one doing it and he was also taking part to this forum conversation. And he did marvelous job with Origin. Now I think he has moved to other areas of Arturia development.

Speaking about Origin development I am little sceptical here. Hopefully I am wrong. Fortunately I have a marvelous instrument allready and I am very happy with (well, the the Big Knob issue bothets me).

Now it's time to hear from Arturia what's going on. Are we waiting for nothing?

Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: DrJustice on October 03, 2013, 07:33:50 pm
This might seem like a no big deal complaint but for the longest time I've been waiting for an update that gives you more precise control over your bpm within the sequencer. What I've been told this is is called fine tuned bpm, in other words being able to dial up so etching like 132.4 instead of whole numbers like 132, 136 etc. you can clearly see that on the Origin it displays as though it's possible (bpm shows the decimal mark). It just boggles my mind that we haven't had a simple update that allows for this....
I don't have my Origin here so I can't test it, but have you tried pressing the "Fine" button?
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: u.n.i.t.e.d on October 04, 2013, 07:09:38 pm
yes,some buchla modules would be a massive feature! ;D but this is probably to much to ask for. some logic-modules would also be a great feature. but i disbelieve that arturia give much attension to the origin :-\ it´s all about the money
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: Cord on October 07, 2013, 12:09:02 am
I think Arturia is busy with their newest real analog creation. I think they moved on... :'(
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: hermitnerd on October 10, 2013, 02:21:32 am

Read the writing on the wall guys...
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: u.n.i.t.e.d on October 11, 2013, 02:51:32 pm
an Elka Synthex Osc & Filter would also be great
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: JacksonP on October 11, 2013, 05:27:35 pm
I must say there's one fix which IMO should be the very highest priority. Well, it does not bother us all, only Origin Keyboard users: midi-functionality. It receives MIDI just fine, but you cannot use it as motherkeyboard. This is a known issue, just read my conversation with Phillippe here: http://www.arturia.com/evolution/smf/index.php?topic=13533.msg35802#msg35802

Compared to other wishes here (new modules and features) this is something Arturia cannot leave unfixed. If they sell nealy 3000 euros product with all those MIDI functions, these must work. I think I am not asking too much, right? In fact I have had synths and keyboards since 80s and this is the very first one which do not send midi correctly.

I'll keep my fingers crossed that this issue and Origin connection will be updated soon. Other things, like all those modules or templates etc., will make me happy too if they are available some day. But first things first.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: bigbrass on October 11, 2013, 08:05:34 pm

ELKA Synthex uses DCO's... Nothing special there. I have to check the schematics, but if I remember correctly the timing pulses that reset the waveforms are all derived from a common clock, which means the oscillators are at the same phase with one another. The filters are Curtis CEM3320 chips, the same ones used in later revision Prophet 5's. I think porting the original rev1/rev2 Prophet 5 filter that's SSM2040 chip based is much more realistic, since Arturia has already developed code for it for their ProphetV software.
BTW, big part of Synthex's sound is its lush analog chorus circuit.

As JacksonP has mentioned before, fixing  Origin connection and preset management should be the top priority. I'd like to be able to change/delete factory presets too. I find many of them useless.

Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: hermitnerd on October 11, 2013, 10:14:49 pm
I think porting the original rev1/rev2 Prophet 5 filter that's SSM2040 chip based is much more realistic, since Arturia has already developed code for it for their ProphetV software.

Really?? ProphetV uses the SSM2040 filter model?
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: hermitnerd on October 11, 2013, 10:43:17 pm
The TAE analong modeling algorithm could stand a tweak too.  Most of the time, adding it just cuts polyphony, and can even sound a little worse.

Hey, at least us Origin owners are the ONLY ones who actually have a TAE knob! ;D

Could you make it go to 11?  ;D
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: Cord on October 12, 2013, 06:45:40 pm
In all defense, Arturia at least presented us with a bug free version with lots of more functionality as there was when I bought my unit. It is an inspiring instrument and you can ask yourself, even when Arturia would leave it in the current state, why it is not more successful?

Anyway, just look at Waldorf and the state they leave their Blofeld in for what now, 2 years in beta?? Arturia at least fixed everything before moving on. A great thanks to them.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: IAA on October 18, 2013, 10:02:11 pm
OK, So I have a "classic". Ill live with that then and just be happy with it.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: noisetheorem on December 10, 2013, 05:25:50 am
We own an abandoned product.  It's our fault for buying, and we all have been duped. 

I will never buy another Arturia product ever again. I say that with all the love in the world for the Origin and what it could have been.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: noisetheorem on December 10, 2013, 05:39:53 am
And bug free? Hardly.  I cannot use the tonewheel oscillator models on my unit.  Any patch I try to add that too causes the DSP to stop producing audio.  It will also refuse to load a new patch after this happens and I have to power cycle the unit in order to get it to do anything.  I posted hear and e-mailed Arturia about it and got no reply...

So pardon my skepticism that we will ever see anything else from them.  They got in over their heads with the Origin, I think, and that is why they now focus on making little toys that don't have the software components.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: Philippe on December 10, 2013, 01:30:08 pm
And bug free? Hardly.  I cannot use the tonewheel oscillator models on my unit.  Any patch I try to add that too causes the DSP to stop producing audio.  It will also refuse to load a new patch after this happens and I have to power cycle the unit in order to get it to do anything.  I posted hear and e-mailed Arturia about it and got no reply...

I've never heard anything about this bug. I've just tried here and it works. Could you elaborate of what you're doing when this crash occurs?

So pardon my skepticism that we will ever see anything else from them.  They got in over their heads with the Origin, I think, and that is why they now focus on making little toys that don't have the software components.

Not true. I am currently working on a stand alone hardware that will have inside - believe me - a lot of "software components".

It is however true that when we started the Origin project 7 years ago, Arturia was not prepared to manage such a complicate development. Things have changed since then. We've learned a lot by doing Origin, and particularly from our errors. Hopefully you'll see that in the coming years.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: noisetheorem on December 10, 2013, 03:03:48 pm
The bug is just plain weird, and it gets weirder the more that I play with it.

What I have found, is that if I try to add a ToneWheel oscillator to a patch, the patch stops producing any sound and I cannot load a different patch after this happens.  What is really exceptionally weird is this ONLY happens (or so it seams) if I am editing patch slot 422 or 423.  I found out last night that patch 424 works fine.  It has something to do with those patch slots, and I have never seen anything like that before in 20 years of using synthesizers!

here is what I do: 
1.  Go to slot 422 and select 'create new' and then select the organ template.  At this point, I can play the sound.
2.  Edit the patch by adding a second tonewheel or other oscillator.  The sound wills top working.
3.  exit the patch (doesn't matter if I save it) and go to load another patch.  The Origin will not let me select any patch. If I go back to edit, I will see that it still has that same patch loaded in the background.  The only way to recover is to reset the the origin.   If I saved the bad patch, then it will reload the same patch when it boots up, only now I can select another patch but the Origin will make no sound.  I have to reset again.   If I didnt save the patch, it reloads an empty patch and everything is fine.

It's really weird.  I ran into it some months ago and reported it and never heard anything back.   It seemed to go away (I didnt' make the connection to the patch slot number).  I started a new album project recently, and started with a clean Origin again and now that I have gotten to patch sot 422, it happens again.  I use the tonewheel a lot because it is *excellent* for creating odd additive drones and as an FM modulator. 

I absolutely love the sound of the Origin, but it feels less like a modular and more like VA construction set.  It's got such a great UI and control interface, the odd limitations in the sound engine are somewhat heartbreaking. 
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: rcmusic on December 10, 2013, 06:06:16 pm
i can not reproduce this
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: goldenanalog on December 11, 2013, 06:18:02 am
Philippe, point blank:

Is the Origin a dead product?

If you are working on development of say: an Origin II, a simple question would be: Would you expect high$$$ synthesizer buyers to trust you after the number of issues that plagued the Origin, and the length of time that it has taken to properly address them, as well as implement promised features?

The real problem I'm afraid has been one of the need for very-long-term committed resources (human and otherwise) to support said product; much which seems to have evaporated.

You yourself don't seem to have been around much lately, Philippe.

Or if you have, you've been largely silent. And please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong - we're adults, here.

And what about oldirtyPastor? Are you going to take care of him? Seems like a real good guy, Philippe.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: tertior on December 11, 2013, 06:29:44 pm

dear patrick, Origin is not dead and 1.5 will be the latest version.
Now the team Arturia,philippe do not know yet but it is inevitable.
Today Arturia returns money and thanks to first Storm users, who's dead.
But Origin is the first hardware and pending Origin two that will be it a digital analog modular, philippe mission will be to finalize the 1.5. and make Origin 2 (if it is not the retirement , I did not take it in my calculation of probabilities)
So, long life to  Philippe.
PS: Phillipe , you can ask to Fred a Augmentation.  ;)
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: nickg117 on December 12, 2013, 11:26:00 pm
Interesting, so if I understand correctly Origin 2 will be  comprised of virtual analog modules alongside a real analog synth?

Thanks for the update by the way!
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: goldenanalog on December 13, 2013, 04:09:28 am

dear patrick, Origin is not dead and 1.5 will be the latest version.
Now the team Arturia,philippe do not know yet but it is inevitable.
Today Arturia returns money and thanks to first Storm users, who's dead.
But Origin is the first hardware and pending Origin two that will be it a digital analog modular, philippe mission will be to finalize the 1.5. and make Origin 2 (if it is not the retirement , I did not take it in my calculation of probabilities)
So, long life to  Philippe.
PS: Phillipe , you can ask to Fred a Augmentation.  ;)

Dear Tertior:

If you addressing me: thank-you! My name is Roger, actually!

The fact is that we in the Origin community *Love* our Philippe; but we *do* need his and Arturia's love back from time to time!

Want to think of something scarey? Consider the collective $$$ spent by Origin users on this forum.And consider the amount of waiting (and many very patiently) for Arturia to fix things and make good on promises it made now years ago.

And keep in mind that your competitor Access has supported every machine that they have ever made for years. Sure: natural bottlenecks w/DSP @ 100 MIPS, but I still have (and love) a Virus A.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: goldenanalog on December 13, 2013, 04:38:30 am
So my plea is for strong consideration of us, your Origin-user base. Please understand that we are not typical $100 software synthesizer buyers, but many who are fortunate enough to have demanding jobs in professional media production environments.

In other words: I see us as best representation of the Arturia philosophy, for better or for worse.

We can either be Arturia's best friends, or their worst critics - which ultimately is up to Arturia itself.

If you have made promises to those of us who have spent many 1000's of dollars on your best product, then keep them! Or at least, do all that is humanly possible to treat your high-end clients as fairly and openly(!) as you possibly can!

Sincerely,

Roger H. aka goldenanalog
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: JacksonP on December 13, 2013, 12:02:38 pm
Wait a second, who said there'll be Origin II…? Did I miss something or do you have kind of a secret knowledge here?

If I read it right, only thing Philippe said is that he's working on a new standalone hardware which has lot of software inside. This can mean almost anything…

P

P.S. but anyway, as said thousand times, I am a double owner of Origin and I wouldn't mind making it little more complete. To me this means working MIDI outs and better computer integration.

EDIT: now I saw a comparison to Access and their Virus support. I own a Virus Ti2 and to me their support isn't the best either. For example, TI has had same problems for years now. Somehow I think Access is denying all these problems and behave like they never existed. Total Integration is very far from total. I have several special problems in my Polar and Access have said to me that they won't fix them and not even try to check what's going on. Not very supportive support...
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: goldenanalog on December 13, 2013, 03:02:06 pm
But Access periodically *is* still coming out with OS updates for the ti2/ti/snow and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future. And as far as the total integration concept: that's a deeper cave that Access dug itself into then Arturia with our beloved Origin: hardware that looks and acts like a vsti ITB. While I agree that their track record for fulfilling their original spec is less then stellar, with the # of computer/ti configurations out there, it becomes exponentially more difficult to support then a 'pure' standalone.

I'll point out specifically that Access did not abandon the 'original' ti platform (replaced by the ti2), which seems to be the danger (at least perceptually) that the Origin One(?) faces. This is especially felt here when even some hardware issues still seem to go relatively unaddressed.

Let's also remember that there is a much greater # of ti machines out there, if you consider that Access really only makes one platform at a time, and that ultimately, each new platform is directly linked with the previous platform (A, B, and C) although the design spec for the ti takes it well out of the 'stand-alone' only concept.
Title: Re: it is time for a new update!!!
Post by: JacksonP on December 14, 2013, 12:51:54 am
IMO there's one big difference when comparing Arturia and Access, which both make great sounding instruments. Well, there are problems with both, but sound is great and that's why we use them, don't we?

Both are quite small companies (at least if you compare them to Roland, Yamaha etc.). But the main difference is that Access have just one product (well, put into few packages) when Arturia has all those softs, hybrids and digitals and real analogs. I must say I've always felt that Arturia is so busy to do new things that their products remain half-finished. Origin included. I am not sure that this is finaly the most wise business strategy. Of course, releasing new products keeps Arturia in the headlines but there's a downside too: there's also growing amount of people that say "I'll never buy another Arturia product". Personally I am NOT saying that but I've read it many many times on this forum and elsewhere too. And as we say (at least in my country) bad news spread much faster than good news. I too have my doubts when thinking about purchasing some new Arturia product: is it buggy like others? Do they support it?  How about hardware build quality? etc.

I agree with goldenanalog that with Access I have a feeling of continuity: their product(s) are made to last quite much longer. They aren't gonna release one product today and tomorrow the next one. Their business philosophy is Less Is More.

But time will tell what's the feeling of this small group of people here, Origin users. Are we left alone with dead product which is one unit after another getting more and more hardware problems and finaly we are told that there's no way to fix them. This is my biggest fear. I can live with my Origin(s), with these functions and features they now have, but it's the build quality which I am most worried about. Another thing is that I've seen how difficult it is to repair anything in a normal way. If an encoder gets broken you probably have to replace the whole board...

Well, after all these rather pessimistic thoughts, let's hope that Arturia will brings us some good news about Origin...